"Friend" got a DUI… wants me at the trial

I’m looking for a little advice here… I already have my thoughts but I’m curious to see if I’m out of line. All of these events take place in Canada.

The story is as follows:

This primarily involves 2 "friends" of mine, both of whom I went to high school with and have been fairly close to since then (I’m 25 now).

Friend A – I live with
Friend B – Is closer with friend A than me, but we’ve spent quite a bit of time together. The only reason he’s around any more lately is because of friend A.

So, June 2, 2007… we plan a round of golf with a bunch of buddies, a BBQ in the afternoon and a trip down to some bars in the evening. Obviously there is alcohol being consumed all day long. Fast forward to the end of the evening… we (A, B and myself) take a cab from the bars to friend B’s house to drop him off, fully expecting to continue taking the cab home where A and I live.

Friend B comes up with the idea to drive us home, which is about a 10 minute drive straight down a 90km/h highway. This was obviously not the smartest move, but he was fairly insistent about it and tends to do this sort of thing quite often (I’ll come back to this). Anyway, we get around the corner from his house where he goes to enter the expressway. The roads in the area are under construction, so in his infinite wisdom he grabs a construction pylon from out of the drivers window of his car and continues to drive down the onramp dragging this beside him. Upon entering the highway, he lets it go and immediately there are lights behind us as he nearly took out a cop car with the thing. Needless to say, we get pulled over… he denies having drank anything but gets the breathalyzer and blows over. Car gets towed, he goes to jail for a few hours, loses license for 90 days.

Fast forward to now. After a few court dates, the trial is set for February 12th. He wants friend A and myself to visit with his lawyer this Wednesday night and has concocted a totally fabricated version of events that he’s trying to get us to recite at his trial. Friend A being much closer to him now, even moreso due to some other circumstances I won’t get into… seems more than happy to oblige. He confronted me last night about this issue and it got fairly heated. Lying under oath is not something that I am taking lightly. My point to him was that both friend A and I were in the car and saw the same things — if he is willing to go out on a limb for you and recite the fabricated story, then having me do so as well is only going to increase the potential for the prosecutor to find some holes in the story. I have yet to be subpoenaed for this trial and have said repeatedly I don’t plan to attend unless I am.

I’m having a tough time with the moral side of this, mainly because he has a long history of bad judgement, driving drunk, run-in’s with the police (mostly minor issues) and so on. I’ve since come to realize that I am mostly done with being associated with either of them. Friend A is moving out of our place at the end of this month and I’m looking forward to being done with them. I’ve recently gone back to school for my MBA part-time, and it’s time to cut out the party animals.

Thoughts? Thanks in advance

I’m looking for a little advice here… I already have my thoughts but I’m curious to see if I’m out of line. All of these events take place in Canada.

The story is as follows:

This primarily involves 2 "friends" of mine, both of whom I went to high school with and have been fairly close to since then (I’m 25 now).

Friend A – I live with
Friend B – Is closer with friend A than me, but we’ve spent quite a bit of time together. The only reason he’s around any more lately is because of friend A.

So, June 2, 2007… we plan a round of golf with a bunch of buddies, a BBQ in the afternoon and a trip down to some bars in the evening. Obviously there is alcohol being consumed all day long. Fast forward to the end of the evening… we (A, B and myself) take a cab from the bars to friend B’s house to drop him off, fully expecting to continue taking the cab home where A and I live.

Friend B comes up with the idea to drive us home, which is about a 10 minute drive straight down a 90km/h highway. This was obviously not the smartest move, but he was fairly insistent about it and tends to do this sort of thing quite often (I’ll come back to this). Anyway, we get around the corner from his house where he goes to enter the expressway. The roads in the area are under construction, so in his infinite wisdom he grabs a construction pylon from out of the drivers window of his car and continues to drive down the onramp dragging this beside him. Upon entering the highway, he lets it go and immediately there are lights behind us as he nearly took out a cop car with the thing. Needless to say, we get pulled over… he denies having drank anything but gets the breathalyzer and blows over. Car gets towed, he goes to jail for a few hours, loses license for 90 days.

Fast forward to now. After a few court dates, the trial is set for February 12th. He wants friend A and myself to visit with his lawyer this Wednesday night and has concocted a totally fabricated version of events that he’s trying to get us to recite at his trial. Friend A being much closer to him now, even moreso due to some other circumstances I won’t get into… seems more than happy to oblige. He confronted me last night about this issue and it got fairly heated. Lying under oath is not something that I am taking lightly. My point to him was that both friend A and I were in the car and saw the same things — if he is willing to go out on a limb for you and recite the fabricated story, then having me do so as well is only going to increase the potential for the prosecutor to find some holes in the story. I have yet to be subpoenaed for this trial and have said repeatedly I don’t plan to attend unless I am.

I’m having a tough time with the moral side of this, mainly because he has a long history of bad judgement, driving drunk, run-in’s with the police (mostly minor issues) and so on. I’ve since come to realize that I am mostly done with being associated with either of them. Friend A is moving out of our place at the end of this month and I’m looking forward to being done with them. I’ve recently gone back to school for my MBA part-time, and it’s time to cut out the party animals.

Thoughts? Thanks in advance

Then don’t go. Or better yet, go, and tell what really happened. You have to do what you feel is right.

And as for your friend…if he makes bad choices, he needs to learn to deal with the consequences of those choices.

Next time he asks about this, give him this simple answer:

No

Then don’t go. Or better yet, go, and tell what really happened. You have to do what you feel is right.

And as for your friend…if he makes bad choices, he needs to learn to deal with the consequences of those choices.

Next time he asks about this, give him this simple answer:

No

Thanks… I told him to give me the lawyer’s address and I’d meet him there Wednesday. I haven’t heard from him yet and if I don’t before later I’m just going to tell him outright I’m not getting involved.
theres no moral issues associated with keeping your friend from having to waste 5000 dollars. lie your ass off.
you are a shitty friend if you dont. a truly horrible horrible friend. you either put him into about 5k debt, or you help him just stay out of debt or even jail.

morals have to include understand the results of your actions

here is what you are faced with

Freind A: $0
Friend A: -$5000

You: Lie
You: Honest

Then don’t go. Or better yet, go, and tell what really happened. You have to do what you feel is right.

And as for your friend…if he makes bad choices, he needs to learn to deal with the consequences of those choices.

Next time he asks about this, give him this simple answer:

No

you just told him to let his freind donate 5k to the government, what if he has kids? student loans? a mortgage? or a car payment or anything else?

i totally disagree. you need to either be a friend or dont be a freind, theres no half way there.

ive got too many people who have gotten owis in iowa city and elsewhere to know that you dont learn anything from getting arrested, you learn you should lie your ass off every time.

you are a shitty friend if you dont. a truly horrible horrible friend. you either put him into about 5k debt, or you help him just stay out of debt or even jail.

morals have to include understand the results of your actions

here is what you are faced with

Freind A: $0
Friend A: -$5000

You: Lie
You: Honest

The guy was stupid enough to drive while intoxicated…why the hell should he get out of it?

If he has loans or shit…TOO BAD. That’s his problem.

If he got himself in debt 5k on a credit card, would you still want him to get out of it?

And for the record, anyone who is stupid enough to knowingly drive drunk is not going to be my friend, or would stop being my friend at that point. Same for if a friend asked me to do what is being asked in this situation.

the OP’s friend should have considered the results of HIS actions…not to mention, what if the OP does lie, and gets shot down in court or charged with perjury? Wouldn’t he be fined or perhaps sent to jail?

Then the OP’s friend is being a bad friend, by your logic.

you are a shitty friend if you dont. a truly horrible horrible friend. you either put him into about 5k debt, or you help him just stay out of debt or even jail.

morals have to include understand the results of your actions

here is what you are faced with

Freind A: $0
Friend A: -$5000

You: Lie
You: Honest

He’s already paid out the ass for this.

There’s no moral issues here? What about the families of people who have been killed by drunk drivers? What about the need for him to learn a lesson? What about lying under oath?

Believe me, it was only a matter of time before something like this happened to him. He already has friend A to tell his version of the events… If I decline to do the same, he’s no further ahead or behind.
I would not go to court and lie under oath for anyone – not even my own family. It could land you in hot water as well if you are found to be lying. You may lose your friends for doing what is right, but if they are asking you to do something that is not right, then perhaps they aren’t really your friends.

. I wouldn’t lie under oath. And I agree with you that it is time to cut these friends out of your life. You don’t want to get into any other trouble because they’re being immature guys. Best wishes and good luck.

He’s already paid out the ass for this.

There’s no moral issues here? What about the families of people who have been killed by drunk drivers? What about the need for him to learn a lesson? What about lying under oath?

Believe me, it was only a matter of time before something like this happened to him. He already has friend A to tell his version of the events… If I decline to do the same, he’s no further ahead or behind.

exactly, hes already been punished. why not help him out.

Its not a matter of time before he kills someone, that argument is bullshit. Ive been drinking and driving since i was 14… *(i dont anymore)… i did when i was 14 b.c if i was drunk and my mom picked me up, i had my permit and if i didnt drive she would know what was up.

see what the lawyer has to say at least.

The guy was stupid enough to drive while intoxicated…why the hell should he get out of it?

If he has loans or shit…TOO BAD. That’s his problem.

If he got himself in debt 5k on a credit card, would you still want him to get out of it?

And for the record, anyone who is stupid enough to knowingly drive drunk is not going to be my friend, or would stop being my friend at that point. Same for if a friend asked me to do what is being asked in this situation.

the OP’s friend should have considered the results of HIS actions…not to mention, what if the OP does lie, and gets shot down in court or charged with perjury? Wouldn’t he be fined or perhaps sent to jail?

Then the OP’s friend is being a bad friend, by your logic.

well this thread would be considered evidence of perjury. perjury is near impossible to prove or charge.
and most lawyers wont risk their licenses to get someone off on an DUI.

exactly, hes already been punished. why not help him out.

Its not a matter of time before he kills someone, that argument is bullshit. Ive been drinking and driving since i was 14… *(i dont anymore)… i did when i was 14 b.c if i was drunk and my mom picked me up, i had my permit and if i didnt drive she would know what was up.

see what the lawyer has to say at least.

It’s not my place to judge whether or not he’s been punished… that’s for the court to decide.

I won’t comment on your situation, but certainly the advice coming from you needs to be taken with a grain of salt.

Yes, perjury is likely very hard to prove or charge. But 0% chance > 0.1% chance.

It’s not my place to judge whether or not he’s been punished… that’s for the court to decide.

I won’t comment on your situation, but certainly the advice coming from you needs to be taken with a grain of salt.

Yes, perjury is likely very hard to prove or charge. But 0% chance > 0.1% chance.

yea it is your place to judge that. its your moral code. which seems to mean if your friends down forget about him

whereas i would rather do anything to keep my friends out of trouble…. jail and fines are wasted resources in my book. its not justice if you dont hurt anyone to begin with
i truly dont see how anyone equate the legal system = justice.

it doesnt. jail for pot/non violent crime/ anything that doesnt hurt someone doesnt = justice

a fine doesnt = justice either, it just means more money going out of your friends pocket

yea it is your place to judge that. its your moral code. which seems to mean if your friends down forget about him

whereas i would rather do anything to keep my friends out of trouble…. jail and fines are wasted resources in my book. its not justice if you dont hurt anyone to begin with

Let’s put it this way:

If he went through a RIDE program and blew slightly over while driving me home, I’d legitimately feel bad because it just as easily could have been me or someone else in that position. I’d go to court and do whatever I could to help him out.

However, that wasn’t the case as I outlined above. Now I am being asked not only to lie about how much he drank, but his reasons for the pylon incident which was 110% his own fault.

For the record, I drove his damn car home the following day after it was impounded and spent the following 90 days giving him rides so everyone could still hang out.

He’s had his license back since September and he’s still drinking and driving… albeit not to the same extent, but the lesson needs to be learned. He’s been in countless accidents due to his careless driving, had speeding tickets and so on. He can’t keep getting a get out of jail free card.

(And for the record, he’s not facing jail, just a license suspension and possible fines)
when you live in a society and reap the benefits of said society, it is your _moral_ responsibility to abide by the rules, just like anyone else, whether they be in your mind "just" or not. If you do not agree with said rules, take extra precautions to not get caught, or avoid the situation altogether (i.e. not driving down the road with a pylon out your window). Friend B is horribly irresponsible and this situation could’ve been easily avoided. Although I think it should be said that original poster and Friend A should have "insisted" on taking the cab home in the first place, but that is neither here nor there. I think if you don’t want to lie, you shouldn’t have to and it is your duty to tell the truth if subpoenaed..just my 2 cents

I agree fully.
don’t lie under oath. people who drive drunk deserve whatever shit happens to them.

(And for the record, he’s not facing jail, just a license suspension and possible fines)

Let’s hope he learns his lesson then.
You have to do what YOU think is best.

I for one have never drove drunk or rode with anyone who has been drinking. Whatever fines your friend has to pay and has already paid, well, there is a thing called consequences for our actions.

I don’t believe I would be able to lie for anyone in a court of law or anywhere else for that matter. Morally speaking I believe to lie is rude, disrespectful, and plain wrong.

You really have two options. You can either go to court and tell the truth, or don’t go (unless you receive a subpoena) and disassociate yourself from these people. Ultimately, you have to do what you think is right, because you are the one who has to live with that decision.
I’ve had three cousins, on three separate occassions, killed in motor vehicle accidents because the other motorist(s) were intoxicated.

Want to talk about morals? How about the thought of defending a possible future vehicular murderer? Yeah, it’s farfetched, but it’s a possibility.

Those who drink and drive are irresponsible, moronic, and complete waste of the oxygen we breathe.

You have a head on your shoulders, don’t succumb to others bullshit. Do whats right.
im sorry about your cousins, but….

a possible future murderer?

so by your logic everyone with a gun is a future murderer kuz people who own guns sometimes murder people! give me a break. yea its farfetched.

im sorry about your cousins, but….

a possible future murderer?

so by your logic everyone with a gun is a future murderer kuz people who own guns sometimes murder people! give me a break. yea its farfetched.

No, by my logic people who drink and drive are possible murderers. What, am I wrong? Come with me to the cemetary, I’ll show you how farfetched it is.
no by your logic people with guns are possible murderers, come with me to a cemetary and ill show you how far fetched it is.
Yuppy is simply wrong about this.
Sometimes we forget that there is such a thing as right and wrong, black and white.

This thing is really, really simple.
If you are subpoenaed and tell the truth then you are morally in the right and have nothing to worry about in the realm of legal problems.

If you go and lie and he gets off.
And if he kills someone while driving while drunk.
You are a part of that. Legally you will bear no responsibility, but morally … morally you got to live with yourself.
Malicious,

Do you want to reinforce bad behavior?

I would not recommend offering any attention to life-threatening acts of stupidity, "friend" or not.

If one of my friends does something stupid, I hang up the phone.

Its the fastest way they will learn.

Most of the time the person wakes up and realizes "shit, we can’t play xbox anymore, its time to stop being dumb"

If they don’t, its no loss.
If a close friend of mine asked me to lie under oath to save one of his friends and I said no, and he left it at that – I wouldn’t be mad. He respected my morals and everything would be fine between us.

However, if he kept asking, pressuring or worse yet started yelling at me, I would be offended and outraged.

Black & White case with me.
I fucking hate drunk drivers. I would testify against his ass. It’s illegal for a reason. Other people’s lives were in danger. Fuck him, he needs to learn a lesson.

Yuppy is simply wrong about this.
Sometimes we forget that there is such a thing as right and wrong, black and white.

This thing is really, really simple.
If you are subpoenaed and tell the truth then you are morally in the right and have nothing to worry about in the realm of legal problems.

If you go and lie and he gets off.
And if he kills someone while driving while drunk.
You are a part of that. Legally you will bear no responsibility, but morally … morally you got to live with yourself.

w/e; if you lie for your friends you are a loyal and true friend.

thi is a fucking misdemeanor, stop making it murder. save em some money/fines/suspension time
Just to clarify, it was the driver himself who asked me to recite a fabricated story… not the other friend.

The two of them are joined at the hip and from what I understand he didn’t even think twice about saying he’d do it. They are both a couple of morons

He tried to relate me doing him this favour to a bunch of stuff he’d done for me in the past (installing a garage door opener, helping me work on my car, helping us move, etc.) I couldn’t help but laugh that he thought this was on the same level.

Anyway, thanks everyone for your input. I was curious whether I was being a shitty friend by my reluctance to lie on his behalf.

Is it bad that I hope he gets everything that’s coming to him?

w/e; if you lie for your friends you are a loyal and true friend.

thi is a fucking misdemeanor, stop making it murder. save em some money/fines/suspension time

I’ve lied for my friends about trivial shit… this is not trivial, and the fact that you think it is tells the whole story for all of us.

Alright.

The story is as follows:

This primarily involves 2 "friends" of mine, both of whom I went to high school with and have been fairly close to since then (I’m 25 now).

Friend A – I live with
Friend B – Is closer with friend A than me, but we’ve spent quite a bit of time together. The only reason he’s around any more lately is because of friend A.

So, June 2, 2007… we plan a round of golf with a bunch of buddies, a BBQ in the afternoon and a trip down to some bars in the evening. Obviously there is alcohol being consumed all day long. Fast forward to the end of the evening… we (A, B and myself) take a cab from the bars to friend B’s house to drop him off, fully expecting to continue taking the cab home where A and I live.

I’m following. Smart move so far.

Friend B comes up with the idea to drive us home, which is about a 10 minute drive straight down a 90km/h highway. This was obviously not the smartest move, but he was fairly insistent about it and tends to do this sort of thing quite often (I’ll come back to this). Anyway, we get around the corner from his house where he goes to enter the expressway. The roads in the area are under construction, so in his infinite wisdom he grabs a construction pylon from out of the drivers window of his car and continues to drive down the onramp dragging this beside him. Upon entering the highway, he lets it go and immediately there are lights behind us as he nearly took out a cop car with the thing. Needless to say, we get pulled over… he denies having drank anything but gets the breathalyzer and blows over. Car gets towed, he goes to jail for a few hours, loses license for 90 days.

You put yourself in danger by driving with him. I hope you never do it again. What he did was foolish, and could have severely injured himself or someone else. The consequences of a DUI are getting more severe as time passes and I believe they should.

Fast forward to now. After a few court dates, the trial is set for February 12th. He wants friend A and myself to visit with his lawyer this Wednesday night and has concocted a totally fabricated version of events that he’s trying to get us to recite at his trial. Friend A being much closer to him now, even moreso due to some other circumstances I won’t get into… seems more than happy to oblige. He confronted me last night about this issue and it got fairly heated. Lying under oath is not something that I am taking lightly. My point to him was that both friend A and I were in the car and saw the same things — if he is willing to go out on a limb for you and recite the fabricated story, then having me do so as well is only going to increase the potential for the prosecutor to find some holes in the story. I have yet to be subpoenaed for this trial and have said repeatedly I don’t plan to attend unless I am.

You are making the right decision to not lie, nor support that process. However I can’t tell you whether you should or shouldn’t attend the trial or take the stand. Think about what could happen if he doesn’t face the consequences? Can you imagine someone’s daughter, mother, brother, father, sometimes child — dying or severely injured in a car accident because he chose to drive under the influence? Can you imagine yourself the type of person who defends or even invests any type of relationship with someone who would do such a thing — making a mockery of justice and the laws which protect you and I?

To be honest, I would probably go to the trial, but this is just me, and I’d take the stand for the "Prosecution" and when it came time to answer questions, I’d tell the story "exactly" the way it happened. I’d make sure it was told so that he would pay the price for what he did, in order that he is prevented from doing it again.

I’m having a tough time with the moral side of this, mainly because he has a long history of bad judgement, driving drunk, run-in’s with the police (mostly minor issues) and so on. I’ve since come to realize that I am mostly done with being associated with either of them. Friend A is moving out of our place at the end of this month and I’m looking forward to being done with them. I’ve recently gone back to school for my MBA part-time, and it’s time to cut out the party animals.

Party animals are fine, criminals are another story. There is no moral consideration here. If you lost someone to a drunk driver or they were injured, there would be no god damn moral issue. He has a history of it, he needs to be stopped. This isn’t about loyalty or ratting someone out — this is about saving potential lives and keeping your own character intact. Imagine him behind the wheel killing your mother. That smug look on his face in knowing he’ll try to get away with it.

You’re already involved. You were there, you know the truth. If that man kills someone down the road, you’ll be partially responsible — perhaps not legally, perhaps not even morally by the judgment and opinion of others, but you can bet your ass you’ll know it inside, and it’ll stay there.

He’ll be ahead by your omission of the truth if you stay quiet.

He was trying to manipulate you. If I did this, then you’re obligated to do that. Fuck that.

Anyway, thanks everyone for your input. I was curious whether I was being a shitty friend by my reluctance to lie on his behalf.

There is no friendship when one person isn’t befriending the other. He ended this friendship long before you did.

Is it bad that I hope he gets everything that’s coming to him?

I absolutely agree. If he has drug problems, alcohol problems whatever — I hope he gets help, but I also hope he pays dearly for the choice he mad.
Oh and just for the record:

  • 300,000 people are injured annually in alcohol-related crashes (about one injury every two minutes) (NHTSA, 2003).
  • 39% of all traffic-related deaths in the United States are alcohol related (NHTSA 2006).

  • An alcohol-related motor vehicle crash kills someone every 31 minutes and nonfatally injures someone every two minutes (NHTSA 2006).
  • The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration released data showing there were 13,470 deaths in 2006 involving drivers and motorcycle operators with blood alcohol levels of .08 or higher, which is the legal limit for adults throughout the country. The number was down slightly from 2005, when 13,582 people died in crashes involving legally drunk drivers.
  • The overall number of deaths involving drivers and motorcycle operators with any amount of alcohol in their blood was 17,602 last year. That was up from 17,590 in 2005, according to spokeswoman Heather Ann Hopkins.

drinking and driving is trivial.

As long as no one gets hurt. If you cant walk you cant drive. but if you can walk and talk fine, may be a little buzzed and can concentrate on the road, then its not a big deal.

Just kuz something is wrong once, doesn’t mean its wrong every time. And no one got hurt here. Just the Asylum junkies are being drama queens like MADD, SADD and RADD

People die drinking and driving when they drive like idiots, not when they decide to obey the speed limits and drive safely home. just kuz your drunk doesnt give you a free pass for driving like a retard… but just kuz your drunk also doesnt mean you should be grouped in with those retards every time

Anyway, thanks everyone for your input. I was curious whether I was being a shitty friend by my reluctance to lie on his behalf.

Is it bad that I hope he gets everything that’s coming to him?

you are nobody’s real friend
Guess not… told him not long ago I wouldn’t be telling anything but the truth at his trial and to let me know if he still wanted me to attend the meeting with his lawyer tonight.

Obviously he said no, then of course followed it up by saying our "friendship" was over. I said I didn’t need "friends" like him and wished him the best of luck.

Case closed.
Mostly I like you Yuppy.
Mostly you seem to have your head on straight.
Mostly.

DUI is not trivial. The only way you are going to learn this is when someone close to you is seriously hurt by another drunk.

It would be fun to shove this thread in your face when that happens.
You know, you are here crying cause your Dad is dead and looking for support. Instead of giving you support we just yell at you and rub this thread in your face.

Truth is, assuming your Dad isn’t killed tomorrow I will forget about this thread. I am a pretty sympathetic guy and will probably be the first person to show you some sympathy.
Pity.

No.
Cause he needs to see some repurcussions for his actions if he is ever going to learn a lesson about how he is acting.

drinking and driving is trivial.
As long as no one gets hurt. If you cant walk you cant drive. but if you can walk and talk fine, may be a little buzzed and can concentrate on the road, then its not a big deal.

Just kuz something is wrong once, doesn’t mean its wrong every time. And no one got hurt here. Just the Asylum junkies are being drama queens like MADD, SADD and RADD

People die drinking and driving when they drive like idiots, not when they decide to obey the speed limits and drive safely home. just kuz your drunk doesnt give you a free pass for driving like a retard… but just kuz your drunk also doesnt mean you should be grouped in with those retards every time
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i went out partying in hollywood one night. i saw a guy drive his car into the center island. it was a rice rocket and the guy drove it up the fucking curb on the center median. i thought he was injured so i parked on the side of the road and watched him for a minute or so. he didnt move at all so i got out and ran over to the car to check on him. the guy passed out and was sleeping. he shattered the front passenger window it wreaked like booze inside.

being buzzed is being under .08. anything more is illegal and illegal for good reason.

"You will not perjur yourself so that your friend can get away with a DUI, therefore you are a shitty person."
how does make any sense?

"You will not perjur yourself so that your friend can get away with a DUI, therefore you are a shitty person."
how does make any sense?

he refuses to even meet with the lawyer. who will tell him to not lie

this guy refused to even goto the meeting to learn what its all about.

more than likely the meeting was about HOW TO ANSWER the questions, instead of WHAT TO SAY.

lawyers wont risk their licenses getting barred for some punk with a drunk driving infraction

this meeting was probably a standard practice

because in law, you dont ask questions that you dont know the answers to.

again it doesnt,

this guy refused to even goto the meeting

more than likely the meeting was about HOW TO ANSWER the questions, instead of WHAT TO SAY.

lawyers wont risk their licenses getting barred for some punk with a drunk driving infraction

this meeting was probably a standard practice

because in law, you dont ask questions that you dont know the answers to.

I never refused to go, I simply told him I wouldn’t be lying under oath and left it up to him as to whether he wanted me there knowing that… which he said he didn’t.

Their case would look really great when friend A got up there and told the fake story and I went up and told the truth

I never refused to go, I simply told him I wouldn’t be lying under oath and left it up to him as to whether he wanted me there knowing that… which he said he didn’t.

Their case would look really great when friend A got up there and told the fake story and I went up and told the truth

here’s the thing. would your friend take a bullet for you? probably not.

at the end of the day, you’re the one who needs to live with this not him. by the way it sounds, it seems like he’s more or less a person you grew up with and is acquainted through him like that.

bottom line is do whatever is going to make you sleep at night. if you go up there an lie, and then worry the next 2 months if you are going to be prosecuted for lying under oath then its not worth it. if you can live with that, go ahead.

by the way, $5000 is not that much money. its not going to devastate his life if he has to pay that fine.
5k is a lot of money for most people who get OWIs. it took a friend of mine over 2 years to pay off the owi he got driving my car home from the bar :-(

No, it’s really not. I’ve had 3 friends killed and one paralyzed in the past 18 months in separate incidents involving drunk drivers. The last one, the guy blew 0.9. Drinking and driving is in no way whatsoever trivial and I cannot understand why anyone would think it is.
Yuppy, you’re skimming the story and living by standard.. Stop being so ignorant and read.

im sorry about your cousins, but….

a possible future murderer?

so by your logic everyone with a gun is a future murderer kuz people who own guns sometimes murder people! give me a break. yea its farfetched.

I actually find one flaw with this analogy.

You have two type of gun owners:

Type one: People who research the gun they purchase. Take a gun safety course. Then go to a firing range and practice with that gun until they are comfortable with it and are able to shoot dead on target. These type of people, in the event of someone entering into their home, will grab the gun and identify loudly that I have a gun and not afraid to use it if you do not leave. Or, at the VERY least, get a good visual on the person in their home BEFORE shooting. (this is taught in gun safety, I know for sure cause I took the course)These people can be compared to sober drivers.

Type two: People who are afraid of being attacked or having their home broken into. They go get any gun at random, keep it loaded, and never practice shooting it at all. (Don’t laugh, I have seen this happen). Then the day comes that maybe their SO or teenage child tries to quietly come home at a late hour. This person grabs the gun in a panic (not being able to think clearly) and ACCIDENTALLY shoots and kills their SO/child. This person can be compared to the drunk driver.

So just because it is UNLIKELY that your loved one would come home late without you knowing it (you could kill someone while driving intoxicated)doesn’t mean it CAN NOT happen and why would you want to risk it even if the chances are slim??????

I actually find one flaw with this analogy.

You have two type of gun owners:

Type one: People who research the gun they purchase. Take a gun safety course. Then go to a firing range and practice with that gun until they are comfortable with it and are able to shoot dead on target. These type of people, in the event of someone entering into their home, will grab the gun and identify loudly that I have a gun and not afraid to use it if you do not leave. Or, at the VERY least, get a good visual on the person in their home BEFORE shooting. (this is taught in gun safety, I know for sure cause I took the course)These people can be compared to sober drivers.

Type two: People who are afraid of being attacked or having their home broken into. They go get any gun at random, keep it loaded, and never practice shooting it at all. (Don’t laugh, I have seen this happen). Then the day comes that maybe their SO or teenage child tries to quietly come home at a late hour. This person grabs the gun in a panic (not being able to think clearly) and ACCIDENTALLY shoots and kills their SO/child. This person can be compared to the drunk driver.

So just because it is UNLIKELY that your loved one would come home late without you knowing it (you could kill someone while driving intoxicated)doesn’t mean it CAN NOT happen and why would you want to risk it even if the chances are slim??????

but you have 2 types of drunk drivers, the one who can handle his liquor and the one who cant. thats like saying im going to shoot someone when i go hunting possibly everytime.

if i slam 10 beers, get up and take a speed limit trip home, i shouldnt have to worry about getting pulled over and having my life turned upside down.

whereas if someone gets drunk, drives home @ 20 mph over the speed limit, and is swerving, they should have hell to pay.

i just wish i could go get drunk, and call for a police escort home without getting into trouble. it would prevent both unnecessary risks for me and the pubic and then i could wake up and have my car at my house. thatd be sweet.

but you have 2 types of drunk drivers, the one who can handle his liquor and the one who cant. thats like saying im going to shoot someone when i go hunting possibly everytime.

if i slam 10 beers, get up and take a speed limit trip home, i shouldnt have to worry about getting pulled over and having my life turned upside down.

whereas if someone gets drunk, drives home @ 20 mph over the speed limit, and is swerving, they should have hell to pay.

i just wish i could go get drunk, and call for a police escort home without getting into trouble. it would prevent both unnecessary risks for me and the pubic and then i could wake up and have my car at my house. thatd be sweet.

how hard is it to arrange to have someone to be a DD? Or call a taxi?

but you have 2 types of drunk drivers, the one who can handle his liquor and the one who cant. thats like saying im going to shoot someone when i go hunting possibly everytime.

if i slam 10 beers, get up and take a speed limit trip home, i shouldnt have to worry about getting pulled over and having my life turned upside down.

whereas if someone gets drunk, drives home @ 20 mph over the speed limit, and is swerving, they should have hell to pay.

i just wish i could go get drunk, and call for a police escort home without getting into trouble. it would prevent both unnecessary risks for me and the pubic and then i could wake up and have my car at my house. thatd be sweet.

at your logic.

The issue is, there isn’t 2 types of drunk drivers, there’s infinite types of drunk drivers.

The effects of alcohol on reaction time, etc. have been proven again and again. Add the variability of human nature into the equation, along with other factors like weather and road condition. You can drive home at the speed limit, but when some kid on a bike jumps out at you and you’re so tanked you can’t react quickly enough, then you’ve got a problem.

The reality is, people have been drinking and driving forever and they will continue to. Cracking down on it will reduce it somewhat, but there will always be someone who will continue to risk it.
Very simple.

When you meet with the lawyer, tell him you will only speak the truth about what happened on that night. The lawyer will remove you from the witness list, plain and simple.

No need to go on trial or take the stand

maybe he shouldn’t have driven drunk

you know, drunk driving fines are absurdly easy to avoid.
Just to follow-up, his lawyer called me Wednesday night and I returned his call yesterday.

He asked if I would be available to attend the trial to tell my side of the story. I let him know that I was aware of the version of events that my "friend" was planning to present and told him that I wouldn’t be saying anything except what actually happened. I said my presence would be detrimental to the case. He seemed quite taken back, and said "That’s shocking… and surprising" as if he actually believed the story he had been told. He thanked me and that was it… all of 30 seconds.

Anyone know what the usual deal is with defense lawyers and fabricated stories? I figured that the guy had to know some or most of the facts were being twisted…

Just to follow-up, his lawyer called me Wednesday night and I returned his call yesterday.

He asked if I would be available to attend the trial to tell my side of the story. I let him know that I was aware of the version of events that my "friend" was planning to present and told him that I wouldn’t be saying anything except what actually happened. I said my presence would be detrimental to the case. He seemed quite taken back, and said "That’s shocking… and surprising" as if he actually believed the story he had been told. He thanked me and that was it… all of 30 seconds.

Anyone know what the usual deal is with defense lawyers and fabricated stories? I figured that the guy had to know some or most of the facts were being twisted…

I know NOTHING of the law. We have people in law school in this forum.

But common sense…
the defense lawyer is there to serve his client in the same way that any professional is there to serve his client.

If his client walks in the door and says, ‘This is how it happened….’ I would imagine that the lawyer wouldn’t be motivated to argue with the guy. Well, he would be, he would be motivated to challenge the guy in the way that he thinks the prosecuter would challenge the guy. But to look at the dude and say, ‘You sir are a liar.’ doesn’t really seem to be in the lawyers best interest.

As such, it might take a slap in the face (like what you did) for a lawyer to wake up that the client isn’t being honest with him.

Just to follow-up, his lawyer called me Wednesday night and I returned his call yesterday.

He asked if I would be available to attend the trial to tell my side of the story. I let him know that I was aware of the version of events that my "friend" was planning to present and told him that I wouldn’t be saying anything except what actually happened. I said my presence would be detrimental to the case. He seemed quite taken back, and said "That’s shocking… and surprising" as if he actually believed the story he had been told. He thanked me and that was it… all of 30 seconds.

Anyone know what the usual deal is with defense lawyers and fabricated stories? I figured that the guy had to know some or most of the facts were being twisted…

First of all…good for you for sticking up for what you believe in no matter what the consequence. I for one respect your decision.

I think some defense attorney’s are just out for the money or how many wins they can achieve …I mean seriously, have you ever heard about how they make rape VICTIMS look like the actual CRIMINAL???? Don’t think for a minute those attorney’s don’t "know" the truth!!!
Cause God knows a rape trial is just a formality.

Why would a woman make up a story about rape? Get real. If people actualy did things like that, don’t you think it would eventually hit the ivy league colleges and the media? Why haven’t we ever even heard of someone that fabricated a rape charge.

Nope.
If he has a dick, you must convict!

Girl power!

Cause God knows a rape trial is just a formality.

Why would a woman make up a story about rape? Get real. If people actualy did things like that, don’t you think it would eventually hit the ivy league colleges and the media? Why haven’t we ever even heard of someone that fabricated a rape charge.

Nope.
If he has a dick, you must convict!

Girl power!

Keep the sarcastic stupidity out. Nobody said that a woman won’t make up a story about rape…

I think some defense attorney’s are just out for the money or how many wins they can achieve …I mean seriously, have you ever heard about how they make rape VICTIMS look like the actual CRIMINAL???? Don’t think for a minute those attorney’s don’t "know" the truth!!!

ok nancy grace

most supposed rape victims are criminals: Falsifying reports/drug use/sodomy/perjury/
And the conclusion to the story, he got off on the charges somehow… as I expected he would because that always seems to be the case.

And the conclusion to the story, he got off on the charges somehow… as I expected he would because that always seems to be the case.

At least you’re not caught up in any of it, then.

And the conclusion to the story, he got off on the charges somehow… as I expected he would because that always seems to be the case.

And now he has another opportunity to hurt someone.
i don’t care if it’s my brother

if he got a dui, it’s on him.

people who get dui’s, or even don’t get them, but do dui, are fucking idiots, and need to be slain.

too many people die from thsi shit. if you think you’re responsible enough to drink, you should be responsible enough to not drink.

loses license for 90 days.

are you serious?! that’s light punishment. tell your friend to relax, this shit ain’t a big deal.

don’t lie for your friend. make him eat the shit.

Whatever you do, do NOT take Yuppy’s advice
@Malicious,

I have been in a similar situation with a friend who reminds me of your friend B. He always drove drunk, cheated on his girlfriends, did stupid shit and lied, etc. etc. ad infinitum, and eventually I got tired of bailing him out. It was a conflict for me, because we were CLOSE friends, really really close but eventually I couldn’t take it.

He cheated on his girlfriend and asked me to corroborate his alibi. I had done this before for him but I just couldn’t do it anymore. We don’t talk so much anymore.

It just happens that way – people turn out differently over time. I hate the thing where to be a real man/a real friend/accepted you are expected to back up somebody who really isn’t even a good friend of yours when they do some stupid fucked up shit like homeboy.

With respect to your situation specifically – DO NOT LIE FOR HIM. Perjury is fucking serious and could have disastrous long-term effects. And plus – how does your friend ever expect to get out of anything after what he did was so over the top?

And the conclusion to the story, he got off on the charges somehow… as I expected he would because that always seems to be the case.

what.the.fuck.?!

ok nancy grace

most supposed rape victims are criminals: Falsifying reports/drug use/sodomy/perjury/

wtf are you crazy?

you just pull stats out of your ass!!

And the conclusion to the story, he got off on the charges somehow… as I expected he would because that always seems to be the case.

It’s all about who you know…..

wtf are you crazy?

you just pull stats out of your ass!!

duke lacrosse

and that only makes news b.c it was a race issue…. it happens a lot thats why the conviction rate of rapists is rather low

duke lacrosse

and that only makes news b.c it was a race issue…. it happens a lot thats why the conviction rate of rapists is rather low

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